OT: BTVS Thread
First of all, newest Angel and Faith Issue:
HOLY SHIT at Whistler's backstory...Whistler is fucking strong. Maybe not Glory's level of strength, but strong enough to casually break Angel's arm, break tables in half and punch right through Angel. He also seems to have some sort of psychic powers, but overall he loves to play powerless person because its easier to manipulate others that way.
Whistler always knew about the whole Shanshu/Twilight thing and pretty much planned for Angel to do all of that ever since Angel got a soul. Needless to say he is not happy.
Whistler is a son of an unholy union between a pureblood demon and an incarnate of one of The Powers That Be. Both sides teamed up and his parents got killed for betraying both sides, but The Powers That Be decided to let their son live, hiding them from the Purebloods and wanting to shape Whistler into a weapon for themselves. Whistler's goal was balance between light and dark, so he was the cause of many good and bad events through the history - he made Arthur draw the sword out of the stone and then ensured his death and fall of Camelot.
WHISTLER IS FUCKING MERLIN OF ARTHURIAN LEGEND AND KING ARTHUR WAS A PROTOTYPE EXPERIMENT preparation for Angel Whistler is the most morally ambiguous character in the whole buffyverse, not bound by the meaning of good or right or morality and living by "ends justify the means" idea. After years of service as balancer between the Power That Be and purebloods like the First, Whistler eventually decided to play both sides and bring about the end of universe through Shanshu/Twilight. There's a nice callback to how destiny works in Buffyverse:
Buffy having litterally ended the World does not sit well with Whistler - he is all about balance and Buffy made sure there's no such thing. The last vision of future Whistler has seen came to him the moment Buffy destroyed the Seed - it was the vision of a dystopian far future. Whistlers has no way of knowing on if its the predetermined outcome, but he is hellbent on changing that outcome, no matter what he has to do.
His current plan is pretty much to forcibly turn entire humanity into magical being, hoping that it would be enough to avert the future he saw. He estimates that if his plan succeeds, at least two billion people will be dead. Angel, actually having learned his lesson not to fuck with grand shit like that is having none of that.Which ends just as expected
We also got the backstory for Pearl and NashThey are half-human half-demon hybrids, a merge between the human emotional way of existence and demon morality. Pearl and Nash actually worked for Angel on the whole Twilight thing. Their scene by their mother's deathbed was both touching and creepy. THey just like Whistler, blame Angel for everything that happened and their goal is apparantly revenge.
Then the first issue of Willow:
The idea of current state fo the world is unbearable to her, as someone who is so closely tied to everything supernatural. Willow, after her powertrip on Angel and Faith is traversing dimensions with Buffy's scythe, summoning demons and stuff, trying to find a way to "fix it all".
She seems to be more in control, capable of stopping herself from going fully evil and toying with the fine line in between.
She has teamed up with a shady horned demon mage, Marrak, who is also "from the same world as she" and is travelling dimensions. Needless to say things are not exactly looking...good:
Bassically Willow wants to become an embodiment and source of magic of entire universe. uh oh. It seems that through Marrak, Willow is slowly getting corrupted and shaped into the Willow we saw in the flashforward to the future. The very idea of "dark magic and light magic" is getting challenged for her in this current dimension, which is the dimension upon which Alice in Wonderland was based on. (I loved the pun at the catterpillar made at her asking her on if she thinks there's "dark science and light science" too) I can't wait to see where this is going.
Why does this have to be so fucking awesome. So far this all blows S8 out of the water.
Does anyone else love and get completly nostalgic on S2 when they hear the Buffy&Angel "theme" music? I just watched "Forever" episode(the one after "The Body") and when they kiss, the theme plays!
I have always noticed, but i have never been able to put a finger on it, but it just hits me that Anya is actually the only titled character that has sexual "freedom". I read a academic analasys of her or BtVS the other day, and i was like "ahhh".
I have always had this "sex is wrong" wipe when watching BtVS but haven't been able to quite see why. I wish i had saved the link, it was quite interesting.
The whole "the show implies that sex is baaad" trope is misunderstanding,really. Yes A LOT of sexual relationships Buffy had turn out bad, but its more like a parallel to REALLY shitty teenager relationships one experiences in life than just "Sex is bad", emphasizing a lot of relatable ideas:With Angel, its a relatability of being rejected after your first time. With Parker its about realizing that someone used you and saw you as something less than a human. With Riley, its all about getting into relationship for all the wrong reasons and idealizing not the relationship but the idea of it. With Spike its all about all the abusive and dysfunctional possibilities both sides of pairing can cause.
Tara and willow, Oz and Willow, Kennedy and Willow, Anya and Xander, etc, continued to have relationships and sex without the world falling over. Hence why it nicely contrasts with Buffy and makes Buffy so relatable - everything that COULD go wrong in teenager's personal life, DID go wrong in her's, but with even more bizzare additions.
Buffy was not limited sexually. She did not just "stick" to "predefined" pairings and acted like a real teenager, actually flirting with others and engaging in conversation with those others.
Just because MOST of her sexual life had problems, it does not mean that show treated sex itself as bad - because, HEY, EVERYTHING in Buffy's life had some serious problems.
(and no the shitty cordelia plotline never happened, ever)
Well yea, but it's not only Buffy really. Willow also. When she kisses Kennedy(I can't remember if it's for the first time, but it's important, because something happend or was about about to happen) Willow gets "punished". The reason for said "punishment" can be argued, since it might not have been how Whedon intended it to come off, but that is how it comes off. It's feels sort of like if something written by someone who was religios to the extreme, but only being allowed to take 1 life partner or whatever one would call it. Ofcause this is this single act alone, since someone extremely religious wouldn't have introduced gay characters.
because, HEY, EVERYTHING in Buffy's life had some serious problems
Yes, i can agree with this, that Buffy's failed relationships and the consequences that having sex had caused her, is to some extent "everyday" in Buffy's life. Bad sides of life hit her in the crouch over and over..
Does anyone else loves Anya's capitalism ideals xD?
I love how they have written Anya's character. In my opinion, she is one of the most humanised characters ever, she's so real and her ideals about love and life were also spot-on perfect. And even for a Spuffy fan like myself, I cry for Bangel moments when Christophe Beck's epic score of Close Your Eyes come in to play. I swear for something that's pure form of music, it has pure emotions that you can really empathise with.
And even for a Spuffy fan like myself, I cry for Bangel moments when Christophe Beck's epic score of Close Your Eyes come in to play. I swear for something that's pure form of music, it has pure emotions that you can really empathise with.
With this I agree.
I do not ship bangel, but I appreciate and LOVE the tragedies and emotions of that pairing.
wait whistler? me wants it now.
Yeah, Whistler. We learned his entire backstory and he is VERY crazy right now. He has seen an EVEN CRAPPIER future than the one Buffy visited, so now its two possible futures, just the one with Evil Willow apparantly is the "good" ending, while the cyberpunk dollhouse-like dystopia one is the "bad ending".
Whistler is on a scavenger hunt for magical artifacts, creatures, etc, anything with magic and he plans to forcefully insert all the magic he would collect into humanity, killing most of it in the proccess, but most likely restoring magic to the remaining survivors that way.
So yeah, it seems that the only way to avoid majority of humanity dead ending as well as dystopia ending, is for Willow to actually turn evil and go down the path we saw in S8