What will Sam and Dean’s legacy be?
The brothers discussed that topic and faced off with a god on Supernatural Season 12 Episode 18.
TV Fanatic staff writers Christine Laskodi and Sean McKenna and The Winchester Family Business’ Alice and Nightsky are ready to talk about it all, including Mary’s possible fate for the season.
So join in the latest Supernatural Round Table to chat about “The Memory Remains.”
What was your favorite scene or quote?
Alice: My favorite scene was the big showdown with the god in the meat locker. That was super creepy!
The way the whole scene was framed really built the suspense. There’s nothing like a deadly, blood-thirsty, goat-headed god to stalk Dean behind the slabs of meat in the dim red light.
Sure, we knew that Sam would bust in and save the day eventually, but still, his kill with the colt was all kinds of awesome. After all, it dusts anything!
Christine: I liked the whole bit in the diner with Dean and the waitress. Even after all this time, it makes me laugh when Dean turns on charm to get ladies.
Nightsky: I cannot believe I’m the only one picking the scene at the end of the episode when Sam and Dean talk about their legacy then carve their initials into the bunker’s table. I thought that would be a unanimous choice!
It was wonderful to hear the brothers talk honestly and sincerely without teasing or jokes about their work, their lives and their legacy.
Carving their initials into the table was, of course, emotional because of the nostalgia, but it was also extremely ominous. That is the kind of thing series do when they know they are going to end soon. It scared me more than anything else the series has done.
Sean: I think there were a lot of good moments from the hour, but I, too, really liked the diner scene. There’s something so simple about Dean flirting and Sam making his remarks about it. The two fit into their classic brother rolls, and it was fun to see during all the intense monster hunting.
What did you think of the goat costume and the actual monster?
Alice: I thought both were really well done.
It’s strange, too, because, on paper, it was a really cheesy idea. To pull off the creep factor with both the fake and real monster was quite an extraordinary feat! It’s the kind of old school horror that’s been missing from this show for a while, and I was glad to see it.
Christine: That goat was all kinds of creepy. Maybe it's my fear of people with masks lurking outside my windows (yes, that's legit). Both the mask and the actual god were so unsettling. Even the little mallet got me. Like Alice said, it's cheesy on paper. But sometimes cheesy horror is the best horror, right?
Nightsky: Again, I’m surprised by Alice’s and Christine’s answers! I thought the goat costume was laughable. It took me out of the moment because it was so B-movie ridiculous to me. The real monster was well done though.
Sean: I enjoyed both as well. There was a creepy factor to just having the goat stare at people, and the actual monster was only glimpsed at. It upped the creepiness without showing everything.
What are Sam and Dean going to do when they find out Mick was killed?
Alice: I think that by the time they find that out, they’ll have already had their falling out with the British Men of Letters and be in all sorts of trouble. Heck, they already are and don’t know it. I don’t think they’ll seek revenge on Mick’s behalf. They’ll just want the British Men of Letters dead because the bastards deserve it.
Christine: You know, I don't really know. I don't think it'll affect them very much at all, to be honest. They barely knew the guy, and what they did know wasn't life-bonding. I agree that they really just want all of the British Men of Letters dead, and I suspect that in their efforts to make that happen they'll discover that Mick was killed.
Nightsky: I’m with Alice that I don’t think they’ll find out until after they are in a battle for the lives with Mr. Ketch. Mick’s murder will completely convince them (and Mary) that the organization is rotten to the core.
I think the brothers will be the instruments that take down the entire hierarchy, then Sam will (eventually) rebuild a new Men of Letters organization the right way.
Sean: I’m sure they will have a certain revenge, but they are down to take down the British Men of Letters soon enough anyway.
Will Mary survive the end of the season?
Alice: Probably not, and I’m OK with that. Bringing her back has been a huge mistake so far. The writers have turned her into an unsympathetic and boring character, which really sucks given her importance to Sam and Dean, not to mention the entire series. She was the one that started everything!
Why bring her back just to turn her into another emotionally detached hunter that we rarely see? I think in the end she’ll sacrifice herself for her boys, just like she’s done before. Sam and Dean will be sad, but since she’s never around, they won’t miss her too much.
They’ll just go back to remembering her like they’ve done their whole lives.
Christine: I think Alice summed it up really well. The writers never seemed to get the story right with Mary, and they've really wasted her all season. They had a great opportunity to reunite the Winchesters and have them kick ass as a family and instead gave us a weird, disconnected family.
Was this what Amara always intended? If so, that's about the only win for the Darkness, wouldn't you say?
Nightsky: I would have said yes before this episode. Now I’m really worried for her. This season seems to bring back characters only to kill them off. I’m afraid Mary might be another sacrificial lamb who dies for no better reason than emotional manipulation of the audience (and the brothers).
I adored bringing Mary back and been very impressed with Samantha Smith. I was even OK with Mary using the Men of Letters to try to end the endless hunting cycle of her family.
I’ve been dumbfounded at the way the writers have portrayed her, though. She seems to be nothing more than a pawn in their storyline rather than the legitimate addition to the family business that she could have been.
I would truly love to see her stay until the series ends, but this detached nonsense has to end.
Sean: I really like Mary, but she clearly hasn’t been used to her best potential this season. I wouldn’t be surprised if she sacrifices herself to save her sons.
Did you enjoy the talk about legacy?
Alice: Yes, it was both sweetly sentimental and disturbing at the same time. There have been plenty of hints that something is going to happen to the bunker and that conversation just about cemented it.
But I really enjoyed the conversation. Those two have a healthy perspective about their place in this world, and that’s refreshing given all the crap they have been through. They could be bitter and angry, but they’re not. They’re just staying true to their mission, which is to leave the world a better place than when they came into it.
I just hope that someone will come along and carry on their work when they’re gone. Their legacy deserves to be remembered.
Christine: It actually occurred to me during that scene that I don't think we've ever really seen the Winchesters have a talk like this before, have we? I mean, little things here and there, sure. But an actual talk about their legacy. That was quite nice. (And the initial carving... ugh. My heart.)
I agree. That bunker is going down along with the British Men of Letters. Which is a shame, because it's really the only place they've had stability in the 12 seasons. But maybe going back to motel rooms would be a nice change of pace.
Nightsky: Yes, but as I said above, it scared me terribly. I didn’t read into it that they would lose the bunker, although I can certainly understand that interpretation in what they said.
I simply cannot believe the series would destroy the bunker (for no other reason than it being their permanent set) unless they are planning the end of the show. The bunker represents real progress in the boys’ lives. To lose that would be devastating to me as a fan.
Instead of that foreshadowing, though, I clearly heard Jared Padalecki and Jensen Ackles talking about other actors taking over the Js legacy and keeping Supernatural alive after the boys stop making it. That desk is now a memorial prop for the Smithsonian or the TV Hall of Fame.
I didn’t hear the end of the bunker; I heard the first step in ending the show. So either interpretation of that conversation is heartbreaking.
Sean: I really liked the conversation, but it sounded ominous to be sure. Something big is going to happen, and soon.
Sean McKenna is a TV Fanatic Staff Writer. Follow him on Twitter.